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hawkman, GrayGhost, schwinn_czar and 3 others like this
Biden is right and wrong.. It's a moral and scientific absolute! Unfortunately, abortion is legal, but slavery was legal too in this land of ours, but it was defeated...this too shall pass.
Added in Politically Speaking, Faith
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hawkman 12 years, 1 month ago
Biden is a senile moron.
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mango333 12 years, 1 month ago
Personally, I'm pro-life. But we can debate that. This guy is a true politician, refusing to take a stand one way or the other. He thinks he can sit on the fence. Unfortunately, sitting back doing nothing on this issue, is the same as taking a stand for abortion. So in a sense he has taken a stand through his inaction.
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egro 12 years, 1 month ago
Slavery was legal, and slavery was bad because it infringed the freedom of other people. While I agree that abortion should be illegal during the later stages of pregnancy, and that it should not be used as a means of birth control, a fetus is not yet a person or a human life.
What are the "moral and scientific absolutes", that "Biden is right and wrong"?
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Cody 12 years, 1 month ago
How is a fetus not a human life? Someone explain that to me...
I was just talking to a friend who had to explain to their 7 year old what abortion was. Not looking forward to having that conversation with my boys.
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Robochess 12 years, 1 month ago
Actually ergo you are mistaken. A baby in womb is alive, it fits all the criteria of scientific life.
I believe that people should have right to do whatever they want as long as they don't harm something else.
I know things happen, and people have bad things happen, but according to easily found statistics, most abortions are because people just don't want the baby. Why can't they take precautions, be preventative? People's laziness, or lack of planning shouldn't lead to this action.
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egro 12 years, 1 month ago
"most abortions are because people just don't want the baby. Why can't they take precautions, be preventative? People's laziness, or lack of planning shouldn't lead to this action."
Absolutely agree! Precautions should be easily available and their use should be encouraged (not denigrated by religious views.)
I never claimed a fetus wasn't alive, I claimed that it is not a human life, and by that I mean conscious, especially early on in the pregnancy.
"A baby in womb is alive, it fits all the criteria of scientific life." I never said it wasn't, but let's be fair. A fetus a few months in development is not a baby, it's a fetus.
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Robochess 12 years, 1 month ago
Point understood ergo. Well said.
I guess my point is the easy and willy nilly attitude people have towards abortion. Should stuff be available for preventative, yes, should the government provide that? I don't think so, but if they do, the old saying goes, cn lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.
I don't claim to have the answers, I do enjoy discussion, because it helps me, and hopefully helps others.
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DirtDoc 12 years, 1 month ago
Actually, early fetal stages are incapable of homeostasis, and therefore do not qualify fully as life. (Well, truth, there aren't hard fast rules about that definition). Not that it matters in the least, possessing life doesn't ensure anything the right to continue living. We deny life to any number of things to sustain our own life, and even then we destroy life when it isn't essential to our continued existence, (bacon, anyone?). It doesn't answer the debate, but being "alive" means nothing. We essential possessing human-ess, ill-defined as it is. We have to admit that from the beginning.
The other option is to conclude that possessing human genes does not make for human life. The same goes with many other items cited by those against legal abortion: the ability to respond to pain, possessing a heartbeat, or kick doesn't save our farm animals. If the life is incapable of possessing consciousness, it has no right to life. Until the fetus is developed to the extent that it is capable of independent thought, it has no right or expectation of life.
The real truth is that consciousness, what is "enough" and how we measure that minimum is not, in any way, at a scientific conclusion. Some parts of it, the "how much is enough part" are outside the realm of science altogether. I, for one, am not comfortable taking away a person's right to bodily autonomy without conclusive evidence.
Robochess - you might be interested in reading about Canadian success with increased access and education surrounding contraception. Teen sexual activity is not significantly higher than the U.S., but per-capita teen pregnancy and abortion is far lower.
Here's one: http://www.canada.com/topics/bodyandhealth/story.html?id=e5dad385-c1d5-4ae2-9681-8aa188f5496a">http://www.canada.com/topics/bodyandhealth/story.html?id=e5dad385-c1d5-4ae2-9681-8aa188f5496a
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